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Mark B
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 8:57 am Post subject: Charles Widmore : Why so nice ? |
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I posted this as part of a different post but I think it may need a seperate topic .....
Is Widmore trying to manipulate Des into doing things ?
I didn't get why Widmore was much nicer to Des in this episode -- in the past (or future) he's been a total arse to Des intercepting his letters to her and even trying to bribe him into staying away from Penny.
Why now give Des the address of his daughter that he so badly does not want Des to be around ?
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Samsonisbad
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:23 am Post subject: |
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Maybe Widmore needs Des to find the Island, so he can contact Penny, so Widmore can then find the Island and get at Ben. I guess what I am saying is that I think that Widmore knows about Ben. |
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robc
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:48 am Post subject: |
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i just thought that bc Penny already hated Des, Widmore was no longer worried about them getting together. Plus if Des joined the Army, maybe that softened Widmore's image of him. |
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Chris
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 11:13 am Post subject: |
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| Samsonisbad wrote: |
| Maybe Widmore needs Des to find the Island, so he can contact Penny, so Widmore can then find the Island and get at Ben. I guess what I am saying is that I think that Widmore knows about Ben. |
There is one problem. How many go sailing a similar path, how many plans fly across the ocean, how many of anything go that direction and not end up on that island. for Widmore to want him to find the island, and eventualy call back he was either A takeing a 1:10000000000 pot shot, or B knows the future and has been leading desmond to it. |
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Samsonisbad
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| Anonymous wrote: |
| Samsonisbad wrote: |
| Maybe Widmore needs Des to find the Island, so he can contact Penny, so Widmore can then find the Island and get at Ben. I guess what I am saying is that I think that Widmore knows about Ben. |
There is one problem. How many go sailing a similar path, how many plans fly across the ocean, how many of anything go that direction and not end up on that island. for Widmore to want him to find the island, and eventualy call back he was either A takeing a 1:10000000000 pot shot, or B knows the future and has been leading desmond to it. |
I guess your right |
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Chris In Oly
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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Widmore was so nice because he had just bought the location of the island. THe ships log for the Black Rock, the slave ship the Losties found on the island. The ship lost by Magnar Hanso, from the blast doors.
He was walking on water - and leaving it running.
Now we know how Widmore finds the island, the auction of the ship log.
I really want to know why Alvar Hanso would sell the log.
Also, it was clear Widmore thought Penny hated Desmond and would kick him to the curb. |
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Mark B
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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I agree Widmore thought Penny hated Des so would not want to see him but why risk it.
Why not just kick Des and say no and then kick him again by saying my daughter never wants so see you again.
Makes no sense to me.
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Joopİ
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:37 am Post subject: |
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Does Ms. Hawking figure into this? It would seem she has a connection to Widmore. She is in the photo with the monk he buys his wine from.
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Matt Lafferty
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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I think that sometimes I have the tendency to see the simplest answer, and for that I can sometimes be very wrong. That said, here's what I think:
Widmore knew Penny was engaged to another man and Desmond was "engaged" as it were to his military career (no quitting that as one might a monastic job!). His telling Des to go see Penny was simulateously Charles being man-to-man to the Army recruit AND kicking a man while he was down ("Go see my ENGAGED daughter... maybe she'll be in the throws of passion with the other man!")
Personally, I totally reject the "puppetmaster" theory that Widmore told Desmond to see his daughter so that YEARS LATER Desmond would borrow a boat from a grieving widow AND use it to get lost AND end up pushing a button in a hatch that apparently no one cared much about.
As for Widmore buying the Hanso diary... again, it might turn out to be a big connection (the real Henry Gale's balloon was from Widmore, right?). However, I think it's just Lost being cute: "Look, in one scene we do Black Rock AND Hanso AND Widmore AND Dickens! Lindeloff and Cuse will love it!"
Now, despite all those clues and the complete lack of any as to who Penny's fiance was (is?) I ask... who might he be? (Or she? 'Cause that would be pretty cool too. I'm just saying.)
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Mark B
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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Not that it really matters but I don't think Penny was engaged in the 1996 falshbacks. She saw Des at the stadium in around 2000 when she was engaged (Des was on island for three years so must have set sail in the race in either late 2000 or early 2001) I think that Des was in training in the Army when we saw him so this was probably not long after he broke it off with Penny so it's unlikely she'd find a new man that quickly.
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Joopİ
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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I wouldn't totally reject the "puppet master" theory. Maybe connecting Ms. Hawking to Widmore is a stretch, but there is definitely some puppetry or "course correction" from Ms. Hawking. She does have the same agenda as Widmore in Desmond not marrying Penny and she specifically told Desmond he needed to go to the island to push the button. Let's not forget that the grieving widow happened to be Libby. There is obviously more to that story. I still think that Desmond's story has parallels to the Oddysey. Odysseus was manipulated by the gods at every turn.
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jg
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Joopİ wrote: |
| Does Ms. Hawking figure into this? It would seem she has a connection to Widmore. She is in the photo with the monk he buys his wine from. |
Is Ms. Hawking sitting on the aisle on the left of this picture?
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Matt Lafferty
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Joopİ wrote: |
| Does Ms. Hawking figure into this? It would seem she has a connection to Widmore. She is in the photo with the monk he buys his wine from. |
#1 Kudos for you and shame on me, because I didn't know Ms. Hawking by name... had to look it up! 
#2 Now that I have looked her up at http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Ms._Hawking WOW I can't believe I had forgotten about her! A few days ago I made a comment somewhere on here about how now that the time travel (that, yes writers, we know isn't really time travel (but it is)) is unquestionably happening, there must be areas worth recombing to apply the time travel stuff to.
Ms. Hawking is one of those areas, to be sure.
Her spelling out how how he must enter the sailing race, go to the island, etc, certainly makes me wonder if she had gone back in time to that point to deliver the info... or somethin'. Oh, well there you go, I just read more on her Lostpedia entry... "In an interview with ew.com the producers suggest that Ms. Hawking travels through time."
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jg
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| Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the link.
I don't think now that the lady is Ms. Hawking, but the lady on the right is looking at me and wondering, "How stupid are you?"
eerie...
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arme00
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| Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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I think Penny's Father is the Economist! |
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Matt Lafferty
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| Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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| arme00 wrote: |
| I think Penny's Father is the Economist! |
That's a fun theory!!
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Mark B
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| Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Matt Lafferty wrote: |
| arme00 wrote: |
| I think Penny's Father is the Economist! |
That's a fun theory!! |
It would be a bit sad if Widmore made his money like Biff did in Back to the Future <insert correct number here> but I like the idea that Widmore ends up being the really bad guy and Ben is right all along and turns out to be a good guy. Though perhaps that is a little too obvious. Not sure what that says about someones theory that this show is a post-9/11 view.
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shiftybench
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| Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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I would hate it if Ben turned out to be the good guy. He hasn't really done anything 'good' and for him to be anything other than the villian (or one of them) would ruin the show somewhat for me.
And it was Back To The Future Part II  |
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Mark B
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| Posted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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Ben = bad
Widmore = badder
Losties = guys stuck in the middle
as someone once said one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter
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Mark B.
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