What do you make of the relationship between the narrator and her mother? And/or, what do you think of her relationship with the other female role models presented in "No Name Woman" and "White Tigers"? Please post at least twice before noon on Feb. 21, preferably on two different days, keeping others' comments in mind. As always, aim to write substantial posts of at least 200 words that quote the text where relevant.
Chinese women are in a very difficult position as we can see from what the author has told us. On one hand, her mother does not appreciate her being stronger than a Chinese woman as she tries to be someone in America. But she still tells her the stories about the woman warrior and seems to admire her. The warrior woman became a hero despite the fact that it was so dangerous for woman to become soldiers; “ Chinese executed women who disguised themselves as soldiers or students, no matter how bravely they fought or how high they scored on the examinations” (39). So it seems to me that her mother still did not want her daughter to be like ‘the warrior woman’ because she treats her like any Chinese girl, like a ‘bad’ girl. “I minded that the emigrant villagers shook their heads at my sister and me. ‘One girl—and another girl,’ they said, and made our parents ashamed to take us out together.” Thus, her mother seems to care about these standards and does not appreciate the fact that her daughter is becoming like the warrior in that she is getting good grades and becoming someone that she ‘shouldn’t be’ according to Chinese culture.
I actually have a sense that Maxine's mother stands up for the no name woman just by telling her story to Maxine. If she wanted her to be forgotten she wouldn't have relayed the story. By coming up with her own account of the story, Maxine defends the woman. She says on page 6 "Women in china did not choose. Some man had commanded her to lie with him and be his secret evil". Maxine invents this whole in depth narrative based upon the sketches her mother told her in order to keep the story alive within her.She is proud of her aunt because she " crossed boundaried not delineated in space" ( 8).
As for Maxine's mother, She wanted her daughter to be more than she was. She told her stories of swordswomen and Fa Mu Lan. Maxine writes that it would be a failure for her to be nothing than a wife and a slave. Even when she is taken the water shows her parents talking and saying that they knew she would be taken. Her mother is the catalyst of the woman warrior within her yet she writes about her choice to be american feminine.
I believe the mother loves her daughter very much and tells her the story of the no name women to show her daughter if she becomes pregnant she will become an outcast just like her aunt. The mother does not want her daughter to suffer.
Sarah may be right, probably the mother does admire the aunt for having a private life, for using "a secret voice, a separate attentiveness." (11) I'm not so sure though... If the mother does though, she is not saying so and is only making sure her daughter does not become like her aunt. I feel the narrator is interested in her aunt since she is so shrouded in mystery. The narrator says herself that "My aunt haunts me- her ghost drawn to me... I am telling her on her, and she was a spite suicide." (16) I feel the narrator admires her for being a secret person and a suicidal.
According to my understanding of the reading, the relationship between the mother and daughter is interrupted by Chinese traditional expectations. The mother constantly calls her a "bad girl." The narrator states that the Chinese believe "There is an outward tendency in females" (47). The narrator declares she would show her mother and father "and the nosey emigrant villages that girls have no outward tendency." (47)
The narrator is this secular person, she is a fighter. She says "the swordswoman and I are not so dissimilar. May my people understand the resemblance soon so that I can return to them." (53) The narrator is therefore saying she is different and she won't return or make herself part of the family until she has recognized that she is different. Therefore the relationship isn’t so close. The daughter is going in another direction.
I feel that through telling Maxine about the no name woman, Maxine’s mother is conveying the great importance that Chinese women have in their families. The Chinese woman is seen as the pride of the family and is also seen as the person who is supposed to bring honor to the family. When a daughter commits an act that dishonors the family it is seen as something unimaginable and something that should be punished with severe harshness.
Through this story I also see two different facets to the Chinese woman, in a sense she can be both vulnerable and full of strength. The vulnerability comes from the fact that many times women did not have choices when it came to whom they would marry. In the case of Maxine’s aunt, she had to marry a man who she had never seen before. “The first night she saw him, he had sex with her. Then he left for America.” (7) Maxine’s aunt was subject to a marriage that she had not longed for but nonetheless had to conform to it and remain silent.
The strength of the Chinese woman was displayed ironically enough also through her silence. When speaking of her aunt Maxine says, “She kept the man’s name to herself throughout her labor and dying; she did not accuse him that he be punished with her. To save her inseminator’s name she gave silent birth.” (11)
I agree with Francis that there is a vulnerabilty and a strength to a Chinese woman. They are vulnerable, as in most history, to the more powerful men of society. They must follow accordingly the rules and expectations of the culture. They also can use this as a strength in that although they are the "lesser" of the sexes, that gives them more room to rise and grow from what they once were. The narrator is able to go from just a weak, vulnerable girl to an honorable, strong, hard-working soldier. A man being a soldier is expected. For her to work towards becoming such a threat to military forces, she is able to show greater depth and a more drastic change.
Her mother may be stuck in between on what she believes her daughter should be doing. She may think she should just do her job as a woman in China and become a wife and mother. Although, it is possible that she envies her daughter's drive and ambition to become such a powerful force. She may be afraid of the danger that comes with this great opportunity. All in all, she seems as though she is a thoughtful and caring mother who wants the best for her child, even if she does not know exacty what that is.
I agree with both Francis and Kristen in that I see the mother's storytelling more as a way to warn Maxine about the dangers of dishonor to a family. Albeit, the Fa Mu Lan story is about a woman who becomes a warrior, the first aspect Maxine points out about the story is that "Fa Mu Lan fought gloriously and returned alive from war to settle in the village," (20).
When Maxine also says "She said I would grow up a wife and a slave, but she taught me the song of the warrior woman, Fa Mu Lan. I would have to grow up a warrior woman," (20) I took this as her way of saying that early on her mother conditioned her on the importance of not only growing up a proper woman, but one with pride and honor to her name.
I also think that the passing on of such stories was her mother's way of passing on tradition, especially considering the fact that her parents were immigrants raising their children in a foreign culture: "Chinese-Americans, when you try to understand what things are in you are Chinese, how do you separate what is peculiar to childhood, to poverty, to insanities, one family, your mother who marked your growing with stories, from what is Chinese? What is Chinese tradition and what is the movies?" (5-6).
Although I think her mother is proud of her somewhat, I think it is extremely hard to be so outwardly in her culture. The narrator states, "But I am useless, one more girl that couldn't be sold. When I visit my family now, I wrap my American successes around me like a private shawl; I am worthy of eating the food. From afar I can believe my family loves me fundamentally." (52) There is a trickiness of the amount of pride they can show for her doing great things because she is a female. "When fishing for treasures in the flood, be careful not to pull in girls" (52), but the author is also able to recognize from anthropology that "Girls are necessary too" (52) even if the Chinese community has difficulty saying it out loud.
I also agree that the mother told Maxine about Fa Mu Lan in order for her to be strong. I think the mother wants Maxine to be a strong women instead of being a slave and a housewife.
As I said before the mother is telling Maxine this as Tiffany said "as a way to warn Maxine about the dangers of dishonoring the family."
I'm just not sure whether the mother is proud of her. If she does, she doesn't mention it. It all depends on our interpretation. Maxine says "When we Chinese girls listened to the adults talk- story, we learned that we failed if we grew up to be but wives or slaves." Maxine's mother I believe tells her the story of her aunt to show her there is possibility, that she can be someone stronger. The mother, I think, doesn't want Maxine to fail at all but she never says that. And the reason is as Kristen says is because its extremely hard to be honest in their culture since they are females.
Maxine says "My mother told others that followed swordswomen through woods and palaces for years. Night after night my mother would talk- story until we fell asleep." The mother clearly wants her daughter to be different but wouldn't support her directly since its forbidden. By telling her these stories she is giving Maxine hopes to dream, she is giving her ambition. I think between the relationship of Maxine and her mother there aren't too many honest words exchanged.
To take a bit of a different tack (and this should be ignored if it grossly disrupts the flow of things), it's interesting to note that there's an elegance to Kingston's writing when she's recounting stories she was told in childhood that isn't present, or is at least much more subdued, when she's explaining the extent to and ways in which that story was formative to her identity as a child. This stylistic break is, I think, indicative of a corresponding disconnect between the respect for a "traditional" heritage which is inculcated in her home and the more immediately pressing cultural demands of her life in the U.S (trying to negotiate Chinese notions of feminitity with those prevalent in the U.S, for instance).
To tie this back to Maxine's mother--she is, obviously, an integral link to Maxine's childhood and the traditions from which she comes. Nonetheless, she's a figure complicated by Maxine's profound ambivalence about her Chinese heritage; it's the mother who's the source of all of these stories for which Maxine has a clear affinity and affection(she almost surely couldn't write them as beautifully as she does where she not possessed of a certain fondness for and appreciation of them), yet the stories themselves are tainted in some respect by the values they subtly perpetuate, and the ways those values are much less subtly driven home by her mother.
You can post new topics in this forum You can reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
